Wikinvest Wire

Thursday, March 10, 2011

Is Savings Rate More Important Than Returns?

On Monday I spoke at a pretty large gathering of 401k investors at a company whose plan we manage. During that seminar there was one question that brought me back to a point I've made once or twice before but that is crucial to understanding the importance of portfolio returns.

The importance of saving money comes up here often and although I don't bring it up often enough, for many people the manner in which they save will be more important than investment results (here the assumption is that investment results are not super human or freakishly bad).

This can matter on several different levels, you figure out for yourself whether it pertains to you or not. One way this is relevant is for people just starting out. I'll use the example of a Health Savings Account because if you have one, you've probably not had it very long. A few years ago when they first became available I believe the maximum contribution was $5000, now it is $6150. In year one if you deposited the full $5000 and had a very good year how much would you have made on the $5000? I think a real good year (not super human) might be $1000 which is obviously 20%.

At the start of the second year if you put in another $5000 the account goes from $6000 to $11,000 which is an increase of 83%--obviously not an investment gain but after the second deposit the account is much larger than the investment result and I would say the discipline to make that second deposit is more important than the investment result. If the investment result in the second year was again 20% or $2200 I would say that would still be less important than the third deposit which by now might able to be $6150 (this has been the max for three years now I believe). You can carry this out as far as you want and decide at what point you think the return is more important than the deposit but it would probably be after quite a few years as getting 20% repeatedly would drift into super human.

Someone who is 50-60 years old probably has something specific in mind about when they want to retire or what their retirement will look like (or at least an aspiration of what it will look like). If this is you, how much money do you have right now? How many more years of accumulation to you plan to have? How much per year can you save while you are still accumulating?

If you planning on 12 more years of accumulation and can put away $20,000 per year (this presumes you are at your peak earnings which we know is not the case for everyone) then we are talking about $240,000. In this example where does $240,000 stand? For some 50 year olds it will be a lot of money and for some it will be very little. If we take a middling number and say the total nest egg today is $200,000 with a 65% equity allocation and over the next 12 years that $130,000 doubles (not a super human result) and the fixed income portion goes up 40% then the $200,000 becomes $358,000. Add in the $240,000 saved and the portfolio is up to $598,000.

I realize the math is overly simple but this is not a blueprint, just an example. It is probably a push as to whether the savings is more important in this example but it is at least equally important as the withdrawal rate from $598,000 is much larger than $358,000 whether we are talking about the 4% rule or something else. I would also note from this example though that $200,000 was accumulated up to whatever age we are talking which was a period of decades compared to turning up the savings and socking away $240,000 in what the end user hopes is his last 12 years of accumulating.

A final point on this regard is that if the last ten years has taught you that you don't have a tolerance for normal stock market volatility then you might only have 40-50% in equities (maybe less?) which means less overall long term price appreciation which places a greater emphasis on savings or as I've worded it before if you want less stock market exposure, no problem, just plan on saving more money.

As a follow up to yesterday's post about dividends a reader at Seeking Alpha left the following comment;

"Even a portfolio with a market equaling yield of 2-ish percent would only need modest gains to meet a reasonable withdrawal rate."

Does this mean that you sell some of the portfolio?

Once the selling starts, when does it stop?

Doesn't selling off assets increase the risk that the client might "outlive their money"?


My reply;

There are countless studies from different sources that draw the same conclusion about a 4% withdrawal rate having a 90-95% success rate (that is not outliving your money).

From where I sit a combination of price appreciation, stock dividends and bond interest over a long period of time works if the account holder can stick to 4%. There will of course be down years but the number crunching behind the 4% rule takes that into account. There is no guarantee but the numbers can work.


The picture is from the green sand beach on the Big Island. The sand is actually green, kind of pea soup colored.

10 comments:

Anonymous said...

Savings is very important.

But, returns are as important if not more important. The coue mment "...as I've worded it before if you want less stock market exposure, no problem, just plan on saving more money." argues the return side. You argue both sides of the argument here.

Both sides are accurate as both are important, but you need to stop saying one is more important than the other.

Savings for retirement is not easy you need BOTH. It takes serious work to fund a retirement that will not be dependent on a bankrupt Social Security program.

Roger Nusbaum said...

i think i'm saying the answer is different for different people at different times while pointing out the possibility that savings c/b more important

Anonymous said...

I for one, found saving for retirement to be quite easy. The method I used for 5 decades was simply pay yourself first. Seize the moment to take the first bit of every kind of income and save it. As an example, in 1986 I had the chance to go to the superbowl. It would have been fun but my good sense took hold and instead of going, I watched it on TV for free. I took that money and put it into an IRA. It has sat there for 25 years. It has grown in size to over 200K. Each year I have done something to set aside something and let it grow. I found it easy to do and I am really well off today because of it. Hopefully someone out there takes this advice to heart-it does work.

Anonymous said...

I call BS on your Superbowl story without any supporting details.

Anonymous said...

Don't save anything. Get a public, union-owned job with a hefty defined benefit and paid health insurance.

Let other taxpayers worry about saving.

Stephen Drone said...

I think savings are way more important in the first half of your life. I think I crossed from savings > investment returns" to "investment returns > savings" somewhere in my mid to late 30s. A big savings rate creates a bull that meager raises each year can't keep up with.

I really wanted to hit the green beach when we were at the Big Island years ago. My wife was pregnant and the trip/walk was just a bit too long for her, so we turned back. I loved the broken wind generators on the road there, though.

RW said...

Stephan's point is extensible to any situation where steady, incremental contributions are made to a compounding asset base; e.g., dollar cost averaging (DCA) is widely recommended as a way to safely invest in funds or build a portfolio generally and it works well because it is so automatic but the impact of each contribution diminishes over time because each new addition becomes a smaller and smaller percentage of total portfolio size.

Those who don't have time or acumen to actively manage their portfolio could save more reliably if they switched from a DCA approach to a value cost averaging (VCA) approach somewhere around the mid-point Stephan mentions because VCA has two virtues DCA lacks: It allows the investor to set a savings target (by x years I need this much in assets) and it provides a mechanism to reach that target (vary contributions based on portfolio/fund performance).

Roger Nusbaum said...

SD, it is quite a hike relative to a day at the beach

Anonymous said...

Speaking of 401(K)'s how about Tom Harkin's take on the 401(K) system?

DE

http://harkin.senate.gov/press/release.cfm?i=331721

Anonymous said...

Who cares? Get to high ground.

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